WEBVTT 00:00:00.210 --> 00:00:09.110 [Music] get ready to take a flamethrower to the official narrative and learn what the elites don't want you to know you're 00:00:09.120 --> 00:00:18.310 listening to the Tom Woods [Music] 00:00:18.320 --> 00:00:28.230 show hey everybody Tom Woods here episode 25003 delighted to be joined by Congressman Thomas Massie a republican from Kentucky uh kson Massie there is so 00:00:28.240 --> 00:00:37.750 much to that one could talk about with you because you've been at the center of pretty much every modern controversy exists in America today but 00:00:37.760 --> 00:00:45.990 welcome back to the show I don't invite controversy but when I run into it I don't look the other way yeah that's I think that's how we all feel we're all 00:00:46.000 --> 00:00:54.270 just trying to live and the controversies keep coming to us right I you know I watched your interview with Tucker Carlson and one thing you said 00:00:54.280 --> 00:01:03.869 really uh stuck out to me and and it resonated with me which is uh Tucker was asking you do you think members of Congress are being blackmailed and that 00:01:03.879 --> 00:01:12.990 accounts for why they have no spine or why their opinions change on a dime or whatever and you were suggesting that the answer may actually be more mundane 00:01:13.000 --> 00:01:21.789 than that it could simply be that they crave they want to be loved they want to be liked by people and by people that 00:01:21.799 --> 00:01:29.990 also includes the establishment it's much easier to live your life if you're more or less going along with at least a bare minimum of what they want you get 00:01:30.000 --> 00:01:40.190 invited to the parties you don't get denounced all the time I mean it it would be tempting for anybody to soften a little bit in exchange for recognition 00:01:40.200 --> 00:01:50.990 and and the reason that that resonated with me so much is that one of the things I've written about about you in my email newsletter is that you seem impervious to this so that on the on the 00:01:51.000 --> 00:02:00.429 one hand you get Trump angry but on the other hand you will be the one who defends him the most against the rush gate claims or the crazy conviction or 00:02:00.439 --> 00:02:08.710 whatever and then the left doesn't like you because of January 6th even though they're supposed to like you for anti-war and then if you could just 00:02:08.720 --> 00:02:18.350 soften a little bit maybe APAC would get off your back so all this time you're upsetting this group and this group and this group and this group most of these groups should like you at least a little 00:02:18.360 --> 00:02:27.350 and you're constantly keeping them on their toes and I feel like it must be especially frustrating when you're the best guy we have by far and yet Trump 00:02:27.360 --> 00:02:35.750 people have been kind of LED from time to time to think rooting against you is the right thing to do good thing you don't want to be liked you you don't 00:02:35.760 --> 00:02:46.030 care if you're liked that's what I mean to say rooting against me is like shorting Tesla stock um it's in the long run it's not worked out for anybody no 00:02:46.040 --> 00:02:56.190 and and on the January 6 stuff yeah I've I've exposed the a lot of the pipe bomb Shenanigans um but remember and I'm 00:02:56.200 --> 00:03:06.309 saying this tongue and cheek I voted to certify the fraudulent election I wasn't part of the January 6th you know the the uh the Democrats try to 00:03:06.319 --> 00:03:16.710 call me an insurrectionist I say I voted to certify the fraudulent election I don't know what you're mad about but that obviously being factious and S and 00:03:16.720 --> 00:03:27.070 sassy with Massie there um ultimately what I realized was we weren't going to change the outcome of the election Nancy Pelosi was in charge and for federalism 00:03:27.080 --> 00:03:36.869 reasons I thought it was a bad idea to set a pressent that Congress can just throw out an election anytime they want because whenever I can leave something 00:03:36.879 --> 00:03:46.949 up to the states or leave something up to DC you're almost better always better off leaving it up to the States but um to your point yeah I've had I've had 00:03:46.959 --> 00:03:56.630 Maga mad at me I've had Pelosi mad at me I've had Trump mad at me uh CNN on March 27th 2020 they called me the most hated 00:03:56.640 --> 00:04:04.750 person in Washington DC and I joke that that is the first and only time I've ever seen him get the news right like I 00:04:04.760 --> 00:04:14.670 was literally had people waiting in line to tell me what an I was on the floor of the house it was like you always had to take a number to come up 00:04:14.680 --> 00:04:25.110 and say something nasty to me that day and I'm talking about Republicans and Democrats both um and and some people say just to use that example by the way 00:04:25.120 --> 00:04:34.350 March 27th 2020 that's the day they passed the cares act and out of 4 135 people I was the only person who would 00:04:34.360 --> 00:04:43.909 object and the reason I know this is I if I needed to go to the bathroom or take a phone call I would ask people can 00:04:43.919 --> 00:04:52.189 you you know fill in for me if I'm gone and they're like NOP not doing it and um 00:04:52.199 --> 00:05:02.350 it was for me that was a very tough moment it was like you can almost physically feel the hate at that point it's like being underwater at a very you 00:05:02.360 --> 00:05:11.950 know very deep uh level at a great depth and you can feel pressure like it's harder to draw air into your lungs sometimes when you've got that many 00:05:11.960 --> 00:05:20.350 people staring at you hating you coming up and telling you they hate you uh but it's it's manifested itself physically never 00:05:20.360 --> 00:05:29.350 psychologically I have I give members of Congress and come up and scream at me I mean scream at the top of their lungs on the 00:05:29.360 --> 00:05:40.189 floor the house because their bill passed 420 to six and I was one of the six and I just have like an outof body 00:05:40.199 --> 00:05:49.950 experience at that moment I Tred to leave my body about three feet you know on the on the video games you can pick if you want to be inside the body or if 00:05:49.960 --> 00:05:58.270 you want to have the The View above the body and I try to visualize myself being screamed at and um just don't scream 00:05:58.280 --> 00:06:06.950 back and they they have to come back in a day or two and apologize they almost always do they just lose it on the floor 00:06:06.960 --> 00:06:16.309 but let me let me say something before before I give it back to you on March 27th 2020 people say that was a brave thing that I did and to be hated that 00:06:16.319 --> 00:06:25.629 much etc etc it was fear that motivated me the fear that I would be back here in 00:06:25.639 --> 00:06:34.749 Kentucky no longer in Congress and some dystopian future some outcome that I could have prevented that somebody could 00:06:34.759 --> 00:06:43.629 have prevented if just one person had objected and to know 15 or 20 years from now that I could have done that and that 00:06:43.639 --> 00:06:52.230 I had been put in that position but didn't do it would maybe have driven me to Suicide you know 10 or 20 years later 00:06:52.240 --> 00:07:02.710 and so I was like I can't live with myself if I don't at least try to stop this which you know I said there would be inflation and shortages and uh things have turned 00:07:02.720 --> 00:07:12.670 out pretty bad probably not as bad as they could have but at least as bad as I said they would be it's turned out to be so U don't give me too much credit I was 00:07:12.680 --> 00:07:23.070 actually very scared that day of how I would feel many years later and here we are four years later I feel pretty good about it well as as you should and 00:07:23.080 --> 00:07:31.390 incidentally I I recently showed my eldest daughter uh the documentary I guess it's about 5 years old now now you're off the grid documentary that was 00:07:31.400 --> 00:07:40.070 made about the way you live in Kentucky and and it it i in fact my wife was watching too and I turned to her and said I need you to understand that I am 00:07:40.080 --> 00:07:48.830 a no Talent nothing compared to this guy describing how you're building your house and you're using the stone that was right there in the so I understand 00:07:48.840 --> 00:07:57.270 the attachment you have to Kentucky and that you moved there you got out of New England uh where you'd gone to school and moved there after working in 00:07:57.280 --> 00:08:05.589 Massachusetts for a while uh because you wanted to be back where you grew up and you wanted to raise your kids there so I totally understand and I I can already 00:08:05.599 --> 00:08:15.589 predict how you're going to answer this question but I I I have to ask I feel like since you've been elected you very consistently become better known uh if 00:08:15.599 --> 00:08:25.309 you were to ask a lot of people you know who share our philosophy they'll name you as by far the best Congressman faint praise but but that is nevertheless 00:08:25.319 --> 00:08:34.269 praise and I think you've become more at the center of of controversy and you don't care if people like you you genuinely want to do the right thing 00:08:34.279 --> 00:08:44.310 you're the exact kind of person you know how to make things you know you're a real person you've worked with your hands you also have an MIT degree and you're a genius who more than you would 00:08:44.320 --> 00:08:52.710 we want as US president why won't you do it iway I wasn't ready for that at the end 00:08:52.720 --> 00:09:03.030 but um you know so I've been in Congress 12 years and uh two years years as a County judge executive before that and 00:09:03.040 --> 00:09:12.069 I've been through a lot and um I look at it as building a stone wall you know and some of my house is 00:09:12.079 --> 00:09:21.710 built out of stone it takes a long time it's hard work and it's like the three Three Little Pigs right they built their 00:09:21.720 --> 00:09:30.870 house or whatever different different ways and I'm just I'm building my political career with stones and uh starting with the 00:09:30.880 --> 00:09:40.790 foundation and sometimes you do things that seem like they're going to make or break you I've had I had a chief of staff once I was going to go on some big 00:09:40.800 --> 00:09:49.389 TV show about some big issue and he's like oh my gosh this is it this is your chance it's going to be all or nothing 00:09:49.399 --> 00:09:58.949 I'm like no calm the hell down this is I'm building a ston wall here and this is just a larger Stone than normal we got to put the mortar on it and set it 00:09:58.959 --> 00:10:08.310 in the wall it's going to not it's not going to change any of the other stones that have been placed and it will you know will make a lot of progress here 00:10:08.320 --> 00:10:17.190 but it's not make or break nothing ever is if you're just methodically doing trying to do the right thing um every 00:10:17.200 --> 00:10:26.150 time and you build some credibility and like we said before the people who short your stock end up not not off there you 00:10:26.160 --> 00:10:37.430 know not looking very bright later on um now to the presidential question so in 2016 I campaigned with 00:10:37.440 --> 00:10:46.550 Rand in Iowa and that was brutal brutal and then in um 2024 here I campaigned 00:10:46.560 --> 00:10:55.430 with Ronda santis in Iowa New Hampshire and South Carolina there let me tell you what there is nothing fun about 00:10:55.440 --> 00:11:06.470 it and it's just grueling and um the odds are so long and um I just I don't think you 00:11:06.480 --> 00:11:17.110 know the world is ready for the truth that I'm ready to tell them I mean they would rather I think be duded into 00:11:17.120 --> 00:11:26.389 thinking there are simple answers and there really aren't many simple answers to the problems we have yeah yeah well that's that's certainly true I I guess I 00:11:26.399 --> 00:11:36.910 I can imagine the kinds of things that uh frustrate you as a member of Congress but something that frustrates me as a US historian is that I'm thinking let's say 00:11:36.920 --> 00:11:48.949 30 years down the road what are the chances that a mainstream history textbook is going to tell the full truth of the years 2016 to 2024 fouchy and Co 00:11:48.959 --> 00:11:57.750 Russia gate January 6 the Trump convictions I I could go on and on it seems virtually certain that it will all 00:11:57.760 --> 00:12:07.350 be fairy tales and that that's what the kids will learn so it's like there are two almost there are two truths in America it's not even that well some people accept gender Theory and others 00:12:07.360 --> 00:12:16.030 don't it's that there are like two different truths somehow weirdly coexisting and I don't know how we break out of that well here's the good news I 00:12:16.040 --> 00:12:26.509 I think you're absolutely right but the good news is there will be archaeological digs back into this era and there will be strata of things that 00:12:26.519 --> 00:12:34.790 happen and instead of digging through and and finding you know porcelain vases and things like that and hieroglyphics 00:12:34.800 --> 00:12:44.189 they're going to be going back through Twitter feeds and Facebook posts and CDC announcements and U it's hard to erase 00:12:44.199 --> 00:12:55.069 that stuff in fact that stuff may be more permanent than the artifacts we F find from 2,000 years ago under the dirt they may last even longer and um I'm 00:12:55.079 --> 00:13:03.230 sure there will be efforts to erase history it'll it in some way may be easier if it's digital and you can control people but I think there are 00:13:03.240 --> 00:13:11.910 just too many copies of it it's almost like blockchain people are archiving it and keeping copies and so um that's the 00:13:11.920 --> 00:13:21.189 good news in this in this era where every you know even the stupid things that I've said are forever ins sconed in 00:13:21.199 --> 00:13:29.470 AR digital archives so people can go back and decide whether that version of history is correct or not in fact a AI 00:13:29.480 --> 00:13:38.670 can do that you could have ai 20 or 30 years from now if it's not completely co-opted by the government and and the 00:13:38.680 --> 00:13:48.470 uh corporations if everybody's got their own AI you could say please go back look at everything from 2016 to 00:13:48.480 --> 00:13:57.710 2024 and given what you know about me tell me the story of what happened hey everybody Father's Day is just about upon us and what are you going to get 00:13:57.720 --> 00:14:06.389 for dear old dad well have about getting something that stands out that isn't the same old thing and let's face it is actually something 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off the table because we already know if we already know that one 00:14:59.920 --> 00:15:09.350 I I'll I'll tell you what my current one is because my current one which it's not the biggest issue in the history of the world but I feel like the the the 00:15:09.360 --> 00:15:17.629 conviction of trump on the quote 34 felony counts and and the the U the weaponization of the legal system I find 00:15:17.639 --> 00:15:25.829 that profoundly disturbing because of what it portends for the future now is it worse than what's going on in Ukraine probably not but it's more recent than 00:15:25.839 --> 00:15:34.749 that and it's got me very very concerned I think ultimately he's going to Prevail uh you 00:15:34.759 --> 00:15:44.749 maybe I'm placing too much faith in the Supreme Court I think right now the P the process is the punishment and so the the weaponization they whether they get 00:15:44.759 --> 00:15:54.350 a conviction or not they're going to be smug and satisfied that they drug him through this and U so that is troubling 00:15:54.360 --> 00:16:03.829 you know a lot of people have lost faith in institutions in this country but I'm beginning wonder if that Faith was always misplaced anyway yeah so maybe 00:16:03.839 --> 00:16:12.749 it's not such a bad thing that we're Lancing the boil here my biggest fear Tom is obviously it's related to the 00:16:12.759 --> 00:16:22.150 debt but not the debt um obviously the music can't go on like it is forever but 00:16:22.160 --> 00:16:32.949 if we if we had some sort of cataclysmic um come to Jesus moment here where we can't Finance the debt and 00:16:32.959 --> 00:16:43.350 there's a crisis and the dollar collapses and then we have to get serious about spending only what uh we bring in and revenue actually that is 00:16:43.360 --> 00:16:53.990 not the thing I fear what I fear is that we avoid that for an even worse outcome my fear is that we slowly devolve into a 00:16:54.000 --> 00:17:02.350 centrally planned Chinese style government that's a mi mishmash of capitalism crony capitalism and 00:17:02.360 --> 00:17:10.710 government control and the thing that this you know 250-year experiment is over and there's not another piece of 00:17:10.720 --> 00:17:22.870 land where you could go that's relatively you know undeveloped uh and set up another experiment that the the globe will be 00:17:22.880 --> 00:17:32.669 monopolized at that point by government or governments and we can't try this again that's my greatest fear Tom is that we 00:17:32.679 --> 00:17:41.950 slowly like boiling a frog although I'm afraid the Frog will never get boiled and we will just have outcomes that are 00:17:41.960 --> 00:17:51.830 far far uh suboptimal from what we could have have and nobody had and nobody remembers what capitalism and Liberty 00:17:51.840 --> 00:18:00.830 and and freedom were all about because those words will be redefined well as you say we'll have to do more excavations to dig up and let's hope 00:18:00.840 --> 00:18:09.310 we're we have enough success that the excavations don't have to dig all that deep but at least we've got a lot of permanent record of you know the way 00:18:09.320 --> 00:18:20.149 things were I I can't help but asking um how you you obviously don't have the greatest relationship with the the speaker but how do you function while 00:18:20.159 --> 00:18:29.909 having obviously at least on a policy level I I don't know maybe you get along with them personally I don't know but how do you function having such an antagonistic 00:18:29.919 --> 00:18:38.789 relationship with the leadership of your party both in politics and just within the bureaucracy of the party are there ways they can make your life 00:18:38.799 --> 00:18:48.310 difficult well um they can we're in this really interesting situation right now where I mean I'm still on the rules committee it's called the speakers 00:18:48.320 --> 00:18:57.590 committee and it you know for at least six decades it's been controlled with an iron fist by whoever the speaker is whether it's a democrat or a republican 00:18:57.600 --> 00:19:08.230 in fact the ratio is n to four there are nine majority members and four minority members so that you could you could have several defections on any given day you 00:19:08.240 --> 00:19:16.510 know a couple defections and one person doesn't show up and you still the speaker still wins the day it's um and I'm still on that committee I joke 00:19:16.520 --> 00:19:25.310 there's another Congressman I don't want to say his name he's from New York he keeps going on the news saying I should be kicked off The Rules Committee it's such a disgrace that I'm still on the 00:19:25.320 --> 00:19:35.190 rules committee and I I I just go up to him and I say redouble your efforts I I've tried everything I can to get off this committee and I'm still stuck on it 00:19:35.200 --> 00:19:44.710 and I appreciate your help but it's not working uh and in fact I have to go back to Congress a day early I I'm gonna go back tonight instead of tomorrow most 00:19:44.720 --> 00:19:53.710 people are going back tomorrow I'll probably go back tonight so that I can be in that Rules Committee hearing that's going to start in the morning um 00:19:53.720 --> 00:20:02.990 so the we're in this weird situation Tom where the minority is so slim that they're almost afraid to 00:20:03.000 --> 00:20:12.070 even uh use strong words against anybody because maybe they quit Congress you know they just throw their hands up and 00:20:12.080 --> 00:20:20.710 leave and now you're in the minority so it's it's kind of funny everybody is sort of being you can get away with anything I don't actually like the 00:20:20.720 --> 00:20:29.430 situation we're in you've got all these gangs that form and you know and a gang is only five or six people there was a 00:20:29.440 --> 00:20:39.470 New York gang that demanded demanded a vote on the state and local tax deduction trying to restore that for parochial reasons uh there was a gang 00:20:39.480 --> 00:20:48.990 that formed of the Intel committee to get fisa reauthorized without a warrant there are gangs that form because the minority is so slim but we're almost at 00:20:49.000 --> 00:20:57.549 the point where the minority is so slim that they they can't really punish one person too much but also you know laying 00:20:57.559 --> 00:21:07.270 that stone wall I've got some credibility and can still even if they took me off every committee I could move the narrative in Congress at this point 00:21:07.280 --> 00:21:16.909 I think and the other thing I would point out is uh they if they took me off of the rules committee at least under Kevin 00:21:16.919 --> 00:21:25.990 McCarthy I was sort of the canary in the colemont and I helped them uh avoid some obstacles that where they would have 00:21:26.000 --> 00:21:34.870 been blind they would have been Flying Without instrumentation and fly flown into the side of the mountain now Mike Johnson doesn't care anymore so he's 00:21:34.880 --> 00:21:45.950 pretty much ignoring the conservatives who were on the rules committee but I would say under Kevin even though I didn't vote for a lot of the bills I was able to tell them where the rocky spots 00:21:45.960 --> 00:21:56.549 were and help them avoid some of that by making some concessions to conservatives and some of these bills so I guess you know I'm still there they it's hard for 00:21:56.559 --> 00:22:07.230 them to get rid of me now people on the out are trying to get rid of me APAC spent $400,000 against me this election cycle um there was burning their money 00:22:07.240 --> 00:22:15.909 at this point but I don't know I'm still here a lot some of the people that have hated on me aren't aren't in Congress and are never coming back like Liz 00:22:15.919 --> 00:22:25.230 Cheney and Adam kininger Max donated to my primary opponents uh in 2020 because of my opposition to the covid nonsense 00:22:25.240 --> 00:22:35.590 and because they thought they could you know it was a good chance to get rid of me again don't short Massie stock well I think a lot of people who 00:22:35.600 --> 00:22:45.669 listen to this show have some interest in your End the Fed bill so I think I would be uh remiss not to bring that up at least briefly if if that bill ends the the 00:22:45.679 --> 00:22:54.470 Federal Reserve does it then lay out what you know Plan B is um well some people say what do you 00:22:54.480 --> 00:23:03.230 res replace the Federal Reserve with well what do you replace a tumor with when you get it out of your body uh there's you don't replace it with 00:23:03.240 --> 00:23:12.789 another Central Bank there's some people that have uh suggested that the FED would be okay if they had an algorithm for their decision about how much money 00:23:12.799 --> 00:23:22.549 I think it's called the tailor rule for how much money you add yeah you know I don't think that's the fix good I B basically you should go back to some 00:23:22.559 --> 00:23:30.950 form of sound money and whether that's backed by gold or whether it's Bitcoin some you know modern digital form of 00:23:30.960 --> 00:23:40.310 that I don't care I'm not trying to prescribe what that should be but one thing is clear it's going to be a lot harder for this government to do deficit 00:23:40.320 --> 00:23:48.950 spending and to fund all these wars if the Federal Reserve does not exist now it may be nearing the end of its useful 00:23:48.960 --> 00:23:57.830 life already I feel like they've pulled on so many levers but all of those levers are connected not with a rigid linkage but 00:23:57.840 --> 00:24:09.630 with a rubber band to the economy and they've got so many of those rubber band stretched right now like I don't even think they have much control over uh 00:24:09.640 --> 00:24:19.909 over interest rates at the moment they could probably stretch that rubber band a little bit and and move it down maybe 1% but I don't think they can they can 00:24:19.919 --> 00:24:30.909 absolutely control it at this point because you've got foreign Sovereign funds who are saying we don't like your bonds and your treasuries at 4% we want 00:24:30.919 --> 00:24:39.430 5% and what are you going to do when they say that well you can print money and you can try to uh make up the 00:24:39.440 --> 00:24:48.110 difference that way but now you're going to fuel inflation and so now you're got to try to pull the interest rates up again to balance that so I think they're 00:24:48.120 --> 00:24:58.630 kind of at that spot where all the rubber bands are stretched out and um it's going to be interesting to see how they get through this meanwhile 00:24:58.640 --> 00:25:07.310 we are sanctioning more and more countries as time goes on like we we've sanctioned Russia we sanctioned Iran I 00:25:07.320 --> 00:25:17.750 mean these are not giant economies but they're not small economies either and it we're sending a signal when we for instance seize Russia's assets uh when 00:25:17.760 --> 00:25:28.110 they you know they bought some treasury instruments and we're saying well we're just going to take all that H Take It Off The Ledger and just keep it well 00:25:28.120 --> 00:25:39.389 that diminishes China's appetite for instance to buy U our debt when we start playing those games and then when we sanctioned Russia as Putin said if you 00:25:39.399 --> 00:25:49.190 made it through his first hour of the history of Russia but if you made it through the first hour of that interview with uh with Tucker Carlson you saw 00:25:49.200 --> 00:25:57.389 Putin say well you know what he he was he said before you sanctioned us 70% of our transactions with other countries 00:25:57.399 --> 00:26:05.950 were in dollars now it's I don't remember the exact number but was less than 20% of their transactions are in US 00:26:05.960 --> 00:26:14.110 dollars with other countries and that's hurting ourselves too so I think they're sort of at the end of their rope they've stretched all 00:26:14.120 --> 00:26:23.510 the rubber bands and the simple answer Tom is you replace it with sound money and and sound monetary policy there a 00:26:23.520 --> 00:26:32.669 there a whole bunch of books that have a chapter on how that transition might be made by the way rothbard talks about a plan George reesman Henry Haslett 00:26:32.679 --> 00:26:42.630 there's there's a whole bunch of G Edward Griffin all whole bunch of people talk about how that transition might work but the very fact that we're even talking about this demonstrates that 00:26:42.640 --> 00:26:52.950 sometimes the Overton window extends in our Direction I as we all know nobody was talking about this before Ron Paul in politics anyway and now it's become 00:26:52.960 --> 00:27:02.389 kind of almost Chic for the odd Republican here and there to say hey there is a problem with the Federal reserve and I and I do want to say here with people watching that I think I I 00:27:02.399 --> 00:27:12.389 have been right on a lot of things but I like to admit when I'm wrong it's a good quality it's it's a rare quality and I'll say that when when Dr Paul ran his 00:27:12.399 --> 00:27:21.990 first GOP Presidential campaign and he was emphasizing the Federal Reserve quite a bit I wrote that he probably shouldn't do this that this is a very technical topic the general public has 00:27:22.000 --> 00:27:30.750 no interest in thank goodness he doesn't listen to me that's all I have to say what a mistake the window has moved and let me give you some specific 00:27:30.760 --> 00:27:39.710 measurables here when Ron Paul left we did one reintroduction of in Def fed without Ron Paul and it was introduced 00:27:39.720 --> 00:27:48.310 by Paul Brown and it it garnered two co-sponsors myself and Ted Yoho now Paul Brown and Ted Yoho are no longer around 00:27:48.320 --> 00:27:58.830 and we and we did that for one more Congress after uh Ron Paul left we went for a decade without anybody introducing a bill to end the Federal Reserve 00:27:58.840 --> 00:28:08.509 and which is kind of remarkable because there are a lot of CopyCats in Congress right I mean I'm I've done a lot of R&D I call it ripoff and duplicate if I see 00:28:08.519 --> 00:28:17.549 a good idea I'll rip it off and duplicate it there's no intellectual property in legislation uh so we'd gone 10 years and 00:28:17.559 --> 00:28:26.190 I said you know what like the things that Ron Paul said would happen have now happened 00:28:26.200 --> 00:28:36.470 okay and the Federal ederal Reserve is doing them more than they did them back then like you know trillions of dollars out of thin air in 2020 they they 00:28:36.480 --> 00:28:46.470 injected into the money supply and uh we've got inflation we've got um you know that's tamed down a little bit we've got high interest 00:28:46.480 --> 00:28:55.230 rates and there's a loss of Faith as we said before in the institutions of this government and I and I was actually 00:28:55.240 --> 00:29:03.590 listening to an audio book by safine amus uh called the Bitcoin standard and 00:29:03.600 --> 00:29:12.070 I I'll warn anybody who wants to listen to that book the first 80% of it is not about Bitcoin it's about money and what 00:29:12.080 --> 00:29:21.669 is money which I think is important to understanding Federal Reserve and also but he he has to lay that down so he can explain what Bitcoin is because you 00:29:21.679 --> 00:29:30.509 can't assume everybody knows what money was and frankly I learned some things or picked up some vocabulary that I didn't have about it there and I'm was 00:29:30.519 --> 00:29:40.070 listening to that tape and I'm like it is time it is way past time to reintroduce a bill to end the Federal Reserve and so I put it in the hopper 00:29:40.080 --> 00:29:52.509 and I thought man I may be the only one maybe I'll get two or three co-sponsors but I don't care this needs to be done I got two dozen co-sponsors so we the 00:29:52.519 --> 00:30:01.909 number of co-sponsors of the bill to end the Federal Reserve in 10 years has gone up 10x um which is remarkable yeah that is no 00:30:01.919 --> 00:30:11.149 small thing absolutely now now given that I've satisfied I hope some of the more intellectual viewers of the Tom Wood show now I want to satisfy more of 00:30:11.159 --> 00:30:19.310 the gossip Seekers I don't I don't know where we got very intellectual well I mean I I mentioned rothbart and Ron Paul I consider that to 00:30:19.320 --> 00:30:29.430 be intellectual but um I I am a little bit curious I I've more or less heard the story but your relationship with Trump is interesting because as I say 00:30:29.440 --> 00:30:38.269 you have not hesitated to come to his defense when he's unjustly attacked which is a lot uh but at the same time you've done a lot of things to annoy him 00:30:38.279 --> 00:30:48.350 and it now for me I would much much rather have an honest critic who has principles and who will back me when I'm right than just a yes man and you are 00:30:48.360 --> 00:30:58.190 nobody's Yes Man uh but he did ultimately even after getting on the phone with you and telling telling you he was going to endorse your primary opponent and all that he did event 00:30:58.200 --> 00:31:06.909 endorse you so was there ever any reconciling conversation or did it did it just develop just gradually or what 00:31:06.919 --> 00:31:15.789 happened oh man you're not going to draw this out of me are you I've never talked about this before um so before I go 00:31:15.799 --> 00:31:25.590 there let me just uh say what my strategy was when he was president was if um he did something right I would 00:31:25.600 --> 00:31:35.350 compliment him the person for for doing something right and if he did something I disagreed with out of deference to him I never criticized him I didn't say he 00:31:35.360 --> 00:31:45.269 was wrong I criticized the policy so I definitely that was sort of my strategy it worked until it didn't uh you know 00:31:45.279 --> 00:31:53.629 when he was mad at me about opposing the cares act he he said um this is the 00:31:53.639 --> 00:32:02.029 second time you've done this uh and they talk me out of it before and it was true I had Ram Paul and Matt Gates and Mark 00:32:02.039 --> 00:32:10.590 Meadows uh and some other folks you know telling Trump please don't crush this guy the the time before that which was 00:32:10.600 --> 00:32:18.990 he had attack solomani uh he killed him you know ordered that attack and we were concerned that there may be an allout 00:32:19.000 --> 00:32:27.909 war with Iran on the on the mainland of Iran remember that was not on Iranian soil and so there was a resolution to uh 00:32:27.919 --> 00:32:36.029 require a vote of Congress if Trump wanted to go to war with Iran and so I had um supported that that's when that 00:32:36.039 --> 00:32:46.669 was the time before that he remembered there were actually other times you know like the fake Obamacare repeal that was just horrible and the freedom caucus opposed 00:32:46.679 --> 00:32:55.190 the fake appeal repeal of Obamacare until they got a little provision in it basically said okay well we're not 00:32:55.200 --> 00:33:04.509 really repealing Obamacare but we'll let the States repeal it individually if they want to that was the concession that got the freedom caucus on board to 00:33:04.519 --> 00:33:13.870 vote for the fake repeal of Obamacare but I never came on board on the fake repeal of Obamacare so I'm just saying 00:33:13.880 --> 00:33:22.230 Trump thought that was the second time that had gone against him it was actually like the eighth time he just was kind of realizing this is that same 00:33:22.240 --> 00:33:33.230 annoying Congressman that keeps you know bringing these facts up um so I was this you know so I won my 00:33:33.240 --> 00:33:43.509 primary during the within eight weeks of the cares act 81 to19 and two years later I had somebody else running against me who said I wasn't Maga enough 00:33:43.519 --> 00:33:51.870 and she couldn't run to the right of me and Kentucky has closed primaries so she couldn't run to the left of me so she ran to the Trump of me and she went down 00:33:51.880 --> 00:34:00.430 to marago and spent $220,000 and was part of that whole scene and got her picture with Trump and basically put herself out there as the Trump candidate 00:34:00.440 --> 00:34:11.909 now he hadn't officially endorsed her but he was like 53 and0 on endorsements and I think there was some concern that she was going to be put on 00:34:11.919 --> 00:34:19.950 the loss Ledger because he had been notoriously against me before and here was a so uh we released a poll that 00:34:19.960 --> 00:34:28.270 showed I was going to win and Trump um his people called me up and and asked if 00:34:28.280 --> 00:34:36.470 I Would by the way remember I'm just trying to keep him out of my race that's all I wanted was a fair shot at winning 00:34:36.480 --> 00:34:45.750 my primary without the former president in my race so when I get a call from his political advisor who said uh the president wants to get in your race I'm 00:34:45.760 --> 00:34:58.550 like oh no not again we're just trying to keep him out of the race it turns out he he was wanted to endorse me and uh my first thought was 00:34:58.560 --> 00:35:08.430 you know everybody's got some pride in them and my first thought was no screw that we're going to win anyway and but then I thought about it 00:35:08.440 --> 00:35:17.230 I'm like you know what I don't really have any animosity toward him uh and we could cauterize this bury the hatchet 00:35:17.240 --> 00:35:26.470 and just move on and that's that's what I did so that his advisor said well we got this cookie cutter uh endorsement 00:35:26.480 --> 00:35:35.670 language and and but we think your situation is a little bit different do you have any suggestions for the language and I said well do you remember 00:35:35.680 --> 00:35:44.270 he called me a third rate grandstander and his political advisor said yes and he said well I think it'd 00:35:44.280 --> 00:35:54.670 be really nice if he called me a First Rate defender of the Constitution this time and he laughed and he said I think he'll do it and Trump did oh to his 00:35:54.680 --> 00:36:03.510 credit so um you know he called me up we had had a the president called me up we sort of consummated this uh and I won't 00:36:03.520 --> 00:36:12.150 tell you the whole conversation because I try to keep that stuff you know private but just to tell you how the conversation began and how we broke the 00:36:12.160 --> 00:36:23.510 ice he called me up and he said Thomas this is your favorite President of all time and I said you are my favorite 00:36:23.520 --> 00:36:31.950 President and he said well you've come such a very long way since the screaming at 00:36:31.960 --> 00:36:41.750 you that's sort of that's sort of how we eased into it where it's it wasn't we just buried the hatchet didn't you know 00:36:41.760 --> 00:36:50.349 so we moved on there was a lot more to that phone conversation that I won't get into just out of respect no of course everybody Tom Woods here with another 00:36:50.359 --> 00:37:00.470 word on behalf of the outstanding monetary medals where I have been very happy to have an account because I earn interest on my gold paid in gold and I'm 00:37:00.480 --> 00:37:09.990 very happy to be joined today for this extremely brief mini interview with Addison quali who actually works for monetary medals how'd that come about uh 00:37:10.000 --> 00:37:18.670 and I think you have a job where you actually really believe in what you do that's correct Tom uh basically I am 00:37:18.680 --> 00:37:27.790 the VP of relationships here at the company um I've been here since 2013 and I I basically lead the sales department and help people come on board mon AR 00:37:27.800 --> 00:37:37.030 medals uh and help handle their accounts um I've always been a big fan of Freedom uh somehow along the way uh was a fan of 00:37:37.040 --> 00:37:45.349 Freedom just from high school that really kicked up a notch when I started following your show in in 2013 and um I was working at a gold company at the 00:37:45.359 --> 00:37:56.030 time um I came to understand that gold is honest money and a very good thing and um when I learned about monetary medals uh back then around 2016 it just 00:37:56.040 --> 00:38:05.150 seemed like something that could change the world for good uh if you can earn interest on gold and Finance in Gold um that is potentially world changing and 00:38:05.160 --> 00:38:14.430 you can get gold to come back into the monetary system so that really excited me I jumped Shi for my old company I joined monetary medals back then and um 00:38:14.440 --> 00:38:23.910 you know one of the exciting ideas we had in our head was at the time Uber was kind of taking out the New York City taxi cabs and Uber had gone viral and we 00:38:23.920 --> 00:38:34.670 thought you know if interest on gold earning yield on gold could go viral uh maybe that could uh become a legitimate alternative to the dollar and um we 00:38:34.680 --> 00:38:44.630 we're excited to be growing a lot uh since then the company's grown by Leaps and Bounds and um it's been a very exciting Journey well I'm very glad to be able to 00:38:44.640 --> 00:38:54.550 be a very small part of it so find out more and join me open up your own account with monetary medals head over to monetary medals.com Woods to get more 00:38:54.560 --> 00:39:04.349 information that's monetary medals.com SL Woods well I appreciate hearing that story well look I mean I know you're you're going back to the capital tonight 00:39:04.359 --> 00:39:12.829 so let me just say uh oh let me just ask is there well first of all my wife will kill me if I don't say to you um she 00:39:12.839 --> 00:39:23.390 wants me to thank you she says he's saving our country so I want you to know my wife loves Youk but the other thing is um we see you doing all this work all 00:39:23.400 --> 00:39:33.950 the time you you you're questioning Witnesses um speak on the floor defending unpopular positions doing things for us what can we as people who 00:39:33.960 --> 00:39:42.270 support you do in return what can we do for you how can we amplify your voice or what would you like from us well first of all one of the reasons you see me all 00:39:42.280 --> 00:39:52.109 the time is I spent a decade trying not to get kicked off of my committees and in this Congress uh through a sick twist of fate I ended up on four 00:39:52.119 --> 00:40:02.030 committees and I even try to get off of some of these committees but I say I ended up with too many credit hours and I missed the drop date so that's why you 00:40:02.040 --> 00:40:10.510 see me on you may see me on Transportation committee rules committee Judiciary Committee a weaponization committee you may be thinking I'm 00:40:10.520 --> 00:40:20.750 switching committees but anyways it's uh but I don't mind it I do not mind it it's a chance we when you get good Witnesses in there it is a chance to say 00:40:20.760 --> 00:40:31.030 what the American people want to be said but isn't getting said to ask the questions that every everybody's got in the back of their head but are afraid to 00:40:31.040 --> 00:40:40.190 utter because they're afraid of looking stupid like for instance recently we had Meritt Garland in the Judiciary Committee and I'm not an attorney I'm an 00:40:40.200 --> 00:40:48.349 engineer as you know and so I'm kind of a fish out of water on the Judiciary Committee to start out with and here I'm questioning a guy who had been nominated 00:40:48.359 --> 00:40:57.510 to be a Supreme Court Justice he's the attorney general and I thought I thought well let's ask him about the Constitution and 00:40:57.520 --> 00:41:08.589 is Jack Smith's position even constitutional because it seems to run a foul of the appointments clause and so I asked that question and 00:41:08.599 --> 00:41:20.030 and actually we he didn't have a good answer the Attorney General didn't have a good answer and and you know in all fairness I relied my U legal underpinning was Ed me 00:41:20.040 --> 00:41:29.589 a former Attorney General's uh amikas brief to the court and I just kind of read that and seemed to make sense but none of the attorneys on that committee 00:41:29.599 --> 00:41:38.270 would ask the question because it's just been a they've for 30 years accepted that this is legitimate position and they don't want to look foolish among 00:41:38.280 --> 00:41:48.270 their peers their peers are lawyers well my peers are engineers and they're also wondering you know what the hell how can you just make this position up there was 00:41:48.280 --> 00:41:57.190 no act of Congress anyways within eight hours the judge in that case says she's going to hear oral arguments on that 00:41:57.200 --> 00:42:05.710 Adas brief a party that's not even named in the case now gets to make arguments in the courtroom and so I think we 00:42:05.720 --> 00:42:17.670 helped you know uh create the environment for the judge to do that maybe maybe not who knows maybe I'm taking credit for something I had nothing to do with that's very uh 00:42:17.680 --> 00:42:26.829 popular in DC I'll indulge in some it myself you as an engineer have done more than all the lawyers put together on this issue I don't I don't know about 00:42:26.839 --> 00:42:36.230 that you got some really good lawyers Dan Bishop is one of them and Matt Gates and Jim Jordan but um so what can people 00:42:36.240 --> 00:42:46.829 do I would say um the one thing they can do is call their congressmen on these issues and go uh engage with them when 00:42:46.839 --> 00:42:58.109 they're somewhere publicly if and I get in trouble for saying this not most of your listeners are not going to like what I'm going to say next but I'm going to say 00:42:58.119 --> 00:43:07.990 um if you can stomach having your name on the FEC report of your congressman and they are not the 00:43:08.000 --> 00:43:18.790 Antichrist go to one of their fundraisers like pay the price of admission their guard is down when you are in a fundraiser you are one of them 00:43:18.800 --> 00:43:27.630 and if you can just pay the Dom Minimus amount to get in that room and have a you know don't be you know an idiot 00:43:27.640 --> 00:43:37.150 have a reasonable short conversation with that person you can actually that's like next level moving the needle with your congressman and maybe you're you 00:43:37.160 --> 00:43:49.069 know maybe you meet read the Austrian economists and Murray rothbard and maybe you're above all of this okay I understand go write a blog post uh and 00:43:49.079 --> 00:44:00.030 you know be pure but if you want to affect things that's one of the things you can do another thing I will tell your listeners I'm not going to say this on a on you know Fox TV because you 00:44:00.040 --> 00:44:10.710 don't want everybody doing this but when you call your Congressman let's say you're you're talking uh and by the way you should call I know we're we're a lot 00:44:10.720 --> 00:44:19.190 of us engineers and uh maybe some of your listeners are introverts and you'd rather write a wellth thought out email 00:44:19.200 --> 00:44:28.470 or a letter and send that not have to interface with the person well guess what a lot of other people are that way too and if you are willing to talk to a 00:44:28.480 --> 00:44:38.190 human being your congressman and your two senators have human beings on the other end that are only going to get maybe six phone calls that day for out 00:44:38.200 --> 00:44:46.950 of 750,000 people a US Representative represents so I would say don't become a frequent flyer don't call every day but 00:44:46.960 --> 00:44:57.870 call your Congressman every now and then and if you want to get past the intern level of interaction just politely ask uh who who 00:44:57.880 --> 00:45:06.470 is the congressman's legislative staffer who handles monetary policy that's kind of like to you or you 00:45:06.480 --> 00:45:14.589 can use the term Legislative Assistant or legislative director but you could say what you know could you let me know which of the congressman's legislative 00:45:14.599 --> 00:45:23.589 assistance and monetary policy and could I talk to that person uh I'm giving you like the keys 00:45:23.599 --> 00:45:32.630 here to the locked door and and the receptionist is probably trained to answer that 00:45:32.640 --> 00:45:40.710 question and they will uh tell you who that person's name is and you could maybe be asked to be transferred to that 00:45:40.720 --> 00:45:50.030 person now you need to be ready to have an intelligent and polite conversation the yahoos who are calling up and 00:45:50.040 --> 00:45:58.829 cussing out and saying I'm never going to vote for this person again if he doesn't vote this way they're not going to know how to do this thank God because 00:45:58.839 --> 00:46:07.430 we don't need our staffers harassed any more than they already are at the front level but if you ask that question I think there's a 50% chance you're 00:46:07.440 --> 00:46:17.349 actually going to get to the person who is writing recommendations for the congressman's votes as they walk to the floor and have to vote on bills or his 00:46:17.359 --> 00:46:25.710 or who the the congressman staffer who is going to um recommend co-sponsorships 00:46:25.720 --> 00:46:34.870 of bills to the con Congressman at a weekly meeting you like so there you go this is if you if you made it through 00:46:34.880 --> 00:46:45.549 the the first 30 or 40 minutes however long we've been on to get to this part you've earned it and now you've got a secret code to get in and to but use it 00:46:45.559 --> 00:46:54.349 you know you've got to use this responsibly and I probably hopefully other congressmen aren't seeing me tell you how to do this well obviously you 00:46:54.359 --> 00:47:05.230 should be calling only your own Congressman because they don't care about somebody somewhere else that's that's one you got to be a voter uh but but three phone calls three phone calls 00:47:05.240 --> 00:47:16.069 don't make any more than three phone calls you have one congressman and two senators do do not call Mike Johnson do not call Nancy Pelosi right right U you 00:47:16.079 --> 00:47:25.990 don't it's just not goingon to you're just wasting everybody's time including your own and by the way in parenthesis I'm surprised that there's somebody who would maybe that's not his only area but 00:47:26.000 --> 00:47:35.270 there's somebody specifically assigned to handle issues of monetary policy because I would think that up until recently everyone would have thought of that as a non-political thing that the 00:47:35.280 --> 00:47:44.790 experts and technocrats at the FED handle well don't let me mislead you into thinking we have an army of Staff like 00:47:44.800 --> 00:47:54.950 we have two or three staffers who deal with legislation and that's it and they divvy up these policy areas often times they divvy It Up by committees right 00:47:54.960 --> 00:48:04.950 because every Bill gets a assigned to a committee so what you might want to say instead of monetary policy if you want to use the DC lingo is who handles the 00:48:04.960 --> 00:48:15.309 congressman's financial services portfolio because there's a financial services committee and within Financial Services you would have monetary policy 00:48:15.319 --> 00:48:25.990 banking policy insurance policy so you might actually be better to say who handles the financial services committee 00:48:26.000 --> 00:48:35.109 uh material for the congressman and again there you know there are over a dozen committees in Congress and we've got two or three staffers so they're going to each staffer is going to be 00:48:35.119 --> 00:48:43.750 handling six committees and infinite number of of legislative issues but they typically have within the office 00:48:43.760 --> 00:48:53.309 delineated who's going to cover what and in my case like science committee stuff I just handle that 00:48:53.319 --> 00:49:02.230 myself they might put you through to me if you say who handles the congressman's science committee technology I always wondered about Ron Paul having an 00:49:02.240 --> 00:49:13.589 advisor on foreign policy and monetary policy I'm pretty sure the man himself knows what to say well that would have been Ron PA's Chief of Staff yeah at at 00:49:13.599 --> 00:49:21.710 sometimes you know you've had to be pretty sharp on that I think but also you know Ron Paul was on Financial Services committee and I think toward 00:49:21.720 --> 00:49:32.230 the end he was a subcommittee chairman or or close to it I testified in front of that committee subcommittee so yeah I'm pretty sure it was himself you know and if you don't 00:49:32.240 --> 00:49:40.349 have if your staff doesn't really prepare you for those committee hearings the committee staff of which there are quite a few there are a lot more 00:49:40.359 --> 00:49:49.270 resources assigned to the committee than there are to the congressman On Any Given issue um they will give the congressman like sample questions which 00:49:49.280 --> 00:49:57.789 sometimes I find helpful you they think to ask things that haven't been asked but usually I tell my staff come on we got to come up with our own questions 00:49:57.799 --> 00:50:06.630 and that's where we get the good stuff yeah sure well one other thing people can do for you is follow you on Twitter or x uh at rep Thomas Massie and it's 00:50:06.640 --> 00:50:15.270 Massie with an ie so rep Thomas Massie I'll put that in the video description and on the show notes page but but I cannot imagine how busy you are so I 00:50:15.280 --> 00:50:24.309 want to let you go but we we all uh appreciate what you're doing and your time today so thank you Congressman Massie well thank you very much Tom look 00:50:24.319 --> 00:50:33.190 forward to being on your show again and look forward to seeing you in person soon thank you very much and thank you ladies and [Music] 00:50:33.200 --> 00:50:41.990 gentlemen make yourself and those you love less vulnerable to the regime both mentally and physically get more forbidden information at Toms 00:50:42.000 --> 00:50:54.829 freebooks.com and be sure to subscribe to the show wherever you listen see you next [Applause] [Music] 00:50:54.839 --> 00:51:04.559 time like the sound of the Tom Wood show my audio production is provided by pods worth media check them out at pods worth.com